Austin Gray: What's going on, everybody? Welcome back to another episode of the OWNR OPS podcast. I'm your host, Austin Gray, and in this episode, I'm hosting Brock Peele from Canadian Sanitation.

Brock has become a good friend at this point—he's been on the podcast several times before. We had him on twice in Season 1, and this episode was recorded at the beginning of 2025 as a recap of his year.

He's got three guys, and they hit $2.3 million in revenue—it's incredible. Brock is insanely focused on his craft of installing and repairing septic systems. They've made a strategic change by no longer pumping septics, and you'll have to listen to the episode to hear his take on why he made that decision. Basically, it allowed him to go from one to six—I'll leave it at that. So, tune in to hear Brock’s recap on how they are maintaining efficiency, what roles he’s handling at this level, and what they’re planning moving forward.

I've learned so much from Brock, and every time I interview him, he encourages me to focus, focus, focus in our business.

Exciting News: New Sponsorship with Jobber

I've got an exciting new sponsorship for the podcast—we’ve developed a partnership with Jobber, the software I’ve been using in Bearclaw since day one. I believe Brock uses it in his business as well.

I’ll be creating more how-to content on our YouTube channel, so you’ll get to see behind the scenes of how we’re using Jobber to optimize efficiencies within Bearclaw. Stick around, because we’re going to be doing more episodes with Brock on how to start a septic business. If you're in the excavation industry and want to focus specifically on septics, Brock will be putting out content to help you get started and grow in this niche.

But for now, let’s jump into this episode to hear more about Brock’s 2024 recap and how they hit $2.3 million with just three guys.

This Episode is Brought to You by Jobber

Jobber is the all-in-one software management solution specifically designed for home service and trade businesses.

I remember when I was starting Bearclaw several years ago—I was wondering how the heck I was going to send estimates, keep track of a job schedule, send invoices, and collect payments. When I came across Jobber, I felt like I had found the Holy Grail.

Jobber makes the back-end of my business so efficient, and it saves me time as a business owner. So if you’re in the early days of starting your home service or trade business, look no further than Jobber as your software management solution.

And if you use our unique link, I get a commission from it—and Lord knows I still have debt to pay down on all this heavy equipment. If you've been enjoying the podcast, this is one way you can support us.

Visit www.getjobber.com to learn more.

Interview with Brock Peele

Brock Peele: We kind of stayed in touch, chatting back and forth a few different times. I’ve been following along, watching everything you’re doing, and paying attention to your posts online. I see you’re doing snow removal—did you always do snow, or is that new?

Austin Gray: Yeah, yeah, yeah—we just launched snow this year. But let’s talk about you. You hit the $2 million mark this year?

Brock Peele: Yeah, I just checked before hopping on to see where we're at. By the time I wrap up my last two jobs this week—just before Christmas—we’ll be at about $2.3 million.

Austin Gray: $2.3 million with just you and two other guys?

Brock Peele: Yeah, me and two other guys for the most part. We did have a bigger team for the first third of the season, but we dialed that back for multiple reasons. One person left, and then another left for a different reason, so we went down to three guys again. That’s actually what we did last year.

Last year, we did about $1.3 or $1.4 million in just seven months in business, so we figured, why not stick to three? We just focused on working as efficiently as possible. I’m in the field full-time, and every time we had work, we really just slugged it out, working as hard as we possibly could to get as much done as possible.

What’s crazy is that with just three guys, we got more work done than when we had five. That’s been a big realization for us.

Austin Gray: That is insane—three guys, $2.3 million in revenue! For those of you who don't know, Brock has been on the podcast twice before. We got into such good content the first time that we had to split it into two different episodes. I believe they were around an hour long each.

If you haven't listened yet, go back and check them out. I believe the titles were Brock Goes 0 to 1.3 in 7 Months. That was your first year after you specialized.

What I want to get into on this podcast is the power of specialization. Could you tell our listeners—especially those who haven't heard those first episodes—about the decision you made when you were a generalist, doing general construction and dirt work? Can you take us from there and walk us through the choice you made?

Brock Peele: Yeah, I—um—you know, when I was a general contractor, I was the classic jack-of-all-trades, master of none. And what I realized was that no one was looking at my company and thinking, Oh, I bet this guy really knows excavation, or I bet this guy is an expert at tiling showers or building decks. It was just too broad.

Now, that kind of work is totally fine for a lot of people—there's nothing wrong with it. Some people want to build custom homes, and in that case, you're a generalist, but you're still specializing in, say, luxury or custom homes.

For me, I was a general contractor, but what I really enjoyed was excavation, specifically septic work. I wanted people to look at me and immediately know what I did. I wanted to do one thing and do it really, really well.

Think about it—when you see a well-known electrical company, you don’t wonder what they do. You know they’re electricians. You don’t question whether they can get the job done. The same goes for plumbers, drywall guys—whatever the trade is. When a company specializes, there’s no doubt about what they do, and generally, there's no doubt that they can get the job done right.

So, that was my thought process. We specialized—fully committed to septics and the sanitation field. We handle septic pumping, installs, and repairs. Now, when people hear Canadian Sanitation, there’s no doubt in their minds about what we do.

We wanted to be the best—industry leaders. And when you call us, you know what you're getting. No one is calling me to tear down a house, dig a foundation, or tile a shower. They're calling me for septic work. That means I eat, sleep, and breathe septics. It’s all I do, every single day.

I know the ins and outs of the industry. I know the codes like the back of my hand. I know what things cost. We do the same thing day in and day out, and that means we’re extremely efficient.

Before specializing, a simple septic install would take us one to two weeks. Now, in peak season, with three guys, we're averaging one and a half to two systems per week. We’ve got two guys on one crew and one guy on another. One guy can handle an install solo, while the two-person crew knocks out another. That level of efficiency wouldn't have been possible before we specialized.

Austin Gray: What is your average job size?

Brock Peele: This year, we’ve really honed in on just slamming septics—no repairs, nothing else. So I’d say our average job size is around $40,000, with a typical range of $30,000 to $40,000.

Austin Gray: Okay, and just to give our listeners a better range—what’s the smallest install on the revenue side, and what’s the top end?

Brock Peele: The smallest job is usually a tank swap. If someone has a failed tank, we can swap it out in a day. We typically charge around $12,000 for that.

Occasionally, we’ll do a septic bed remediation, where we jet the lines. But honestly, I try to talk my clients out of that. I know I could charge them $5,000 to $7,000 to jet the bed, but in six months, they’ll be calling me again when it doesn’t work. Then they’ll have to spend $30,000 on a new bed anyway. If they don’t want to go with me, that’s fine—I just don’t want to take their money for something I can’t warranty or guarantee.

That said, we have done a few bed jetting jobs this year, but only in cases where a new septic wasn’t possible without drilling a well. In one case, the job would have cost six figures, so it made sense for them to spend $4,500 on jetting as a temporary solution. We were already swapping their tank for $13,000, so adding the jetting brought the total to about $17,000. But if they had needed a whole new system, it would have been over $100,000 because of additional requirements like drilling a well and installing an advanced treatment system.

So, to answer your question—on the low end, we might do a $5,000 or $6,000 job on rare occasions, but generally, $12,000 is our minimum. Our most expensive septic system this year was around $135,000.

Austin Gray: And why six figures for that system? Big house? Big field? Big tank? What drove that cost?

Brock Peele: The big driving factor in that one major would have been the well. So, according to the Ontario Building Code, you’ve got to be 100 feet (30 meters) from a dug well, 50 feet (15 meters) from a drilled well, and 15 meters from the water.

This was a waterfront property, so to install the system, we would have had to get a new well drilled. Then, they would have had to run a whole new line from the house and trench it. We also had to move the septic tank because it was too close to the water. That meant taking it out, putting in an ejector pump chamber, and relocating the tank to the higher side of the property.

There was a lot of rock and trees in the area, so we had to clear an entire section. The owners would have lost all their privacy because we had to remove large maples to get the bed in place. Additionally, since it was a decent-sized house, the septic system alone would have cost around $50,000 to $55,000—probably $45,000 at the lowest. But, because of the waterfront location and space constraints, we likely would have had to install a tertiary system with advanced treatment.

We often use Bof filters for nitrogen and phosphorus removal, especially for properties near water. Many municipalities require that level of treatment, which bumps the price up by at least 20-25%. So realistically, we were looking at a $60,000 system. Then, factoring in additional work, like electrical installation and pump chambers, plus the well costing around $30,000, the total easily approached $100,000.

Austin Gray: Nice. Let’s talk about the equipment you need for this business model.

Brock Peele: What we need and what I have—those are two different things.

Austin Gray: What are you using? What did you run with this year, equipment-wise?

Brock Peele: We picked up another T66 skid steer, so now we have two of those. We also have our Bobcat E50 (a 5-ton mini excavator), our Hyundai HX130 (a 13-ton excavator), a dump truck, and a few float trailers. That’s really it. We also sold our septic pumping truck and the roll-off truck this year.

Austin Gray: I remember when you texted me earlier this year, saying, “Yep, little bit of a change in the model—sold the septic pumper.” Could you talk us through that?

Just to recap, you have:

• Two skid steers
• Two Bobcat T66s
• A Bobcat E50
• A Hyundai HX130 (13-ton excavator)

Brock Peele: Yeah.

Austin Gray: Do you like the T66?

Brock Peele: Yeah, they’re good. We've had some issues with the new one, though. It only has about 100 hours on it, but it’s been in and out of the dealer for about two months now. They gave us a rental machine in the meantime, but it’s a clapped-out 595 with no rear-view camera and no lift tracks.

I was ranting to a buddy about it last night because I paid over $100,000 for this new machine, got it wrapped and outfitted exactly how I wanted it, and now, with only 90 hours on it, it's sitting at the dealer. Meanwhile, I’m stuck using this worn-out rental with 4,000 hours, tracks falling off, and no backup camera. I’m making payments on my brand-new T66, and they think they’re doing me a favor by giving me this rental? That’s not going to fly. If they don’t figure something out soon, heads are going to roll.

Other than that, my first T66 is solid. I really like them overall. The look, the cab, the operator setup, and especially the visibility are great. I tried out a brand-new 325 this year, and while it’s a good machine, I found the controls a bit jumpy. The visibility for final grading wasn’t as nice because of the loader arms—I couldn’t see the bucket tips as well. That’s one thing I love about Bobcats—their loader frame is ergonomic, rounded, and thin, which makes visibility a huge plus. Everyone who hops into our T66s says, “Wow, the visibility in these is incredible.”

Austin Gray: Yeah, my dad had one of those machines. I actually rented it from him when I started my business, and man, I freaking loved that machine. It’s snappy, nimble, gets into tight spaces, and responds quickly.

Okay, so you have two T66s and an E55, which I believe is an older version of the current E50 Bobcat, right?

Brock Peele: No, I think it’s the other way around. Now, they have the E55, and the E50 is the older model. We have the E50, which is a little bit older.

Austin Gray: Got it. And what was your big excavator?

Brock Peele: The HX130—it's a 13-ton Hyundai.

Austin Gray: Did you buy all of those new or used?

Brock Peele: The two skid steers and the HX130 were brand new. Looking back, I’ve reflected on those purchases and payments, wondering if we made the right call. A friend of mine just bought a really nice used John Deere 13-ton for about $140,000 CAD.

Everything is expensive for us in Canada. That same machine cost us $265,000 out the door. Part of me wonders if we should’ve gone used with a higher interest rate and paid it off faster. But at the end of the day, we wouldn’t be where we are without that 13-ton. We couldn’t have taken on the work we did or completed projects as efficiently. That machine has built us and pushed us forward.

If it weren’t for the way we acquired it, things might have gone differently. We rented it for six months, and 100% of that rental fee went toward the purchase price. That deal made a huge difference for us.

That said, I do think there’s a lot to be said about buying used equipment with cash. Our dump truck, E50, pickup trucks, trailers, and van are all owned outright. The only things we financed are the two skid steers and the 13-ton.

Austin Gray: Just to clarify for listeners, that $265,000 was in Canadian dollars?
‍
Brock Peele: Yeah.

Austin Gray: And that would be 195 grand or 196 grand USD. So, break that down—what was your monthly rent payment to start, and then what did it transfer to whenever you decided to do a purchase agreement with them?

Brock Peele: Yeah, so it was around $7,000 a month. That was the rent on it—around seven grand a month. I think that was with taxes and everything. I don't quite remember exactly, but it was a healthy amount. We took that on week one, basically. Our first job as Canadian Sanitation—I have a picture of that 13-ton. That was the first job we ever did as Canadian Sanitation with that machine sitting there at $13,000.

Seven grand a month, plus a brand new skid steer—honestly, a little bit mental now that I think about it. But we made a go of it, and it worked out. Once we did the purchase, we ended up putting down around $65,000, including the rental payments we had already made. We put some extra money down, had to pay the HST, and got a wrist bucket with it. So, our monthly payment on it now is about $4,750 a month.

Austin Gray: That's after it transferred to the financed agreement?

Brock Peele: Yeah, yeah. And our interest rate is super low. I'd have to double-check, but I think it's around 1.5% or 2% interest.

Austin Gray: Okay, so that's about $3,511 USD for your monthly payment. How long did you spread that out?

Brock Peele: I believe it's five years. It might be four—I don't quite remember. I'm hoping not to go the full term on it anyway.

Austin Gray: Yeah, I hear you on that. I always go back and forth—do you use cash to pay down equipment and get rid of that monthly nut, or do you use cash for growth? I want to get into that here in a bit, but first, I want to give listeners the big picture of your current business model—how you hit $2.3 million with three guys in septic installation.

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Austin Gray: So, you've made some strategic decisions along the way. Now that we have an understanding of your equipment, I want to jump into roles and responsibilities. You have three guys—you must be doing a lot. It sounds like you're still doing estimating, sales, things like that, but you're also jumping into the field too, correct?

Brock Peele: Yeah, yeah. When systems are going, I would say that from July or August onward this year, I've been in the field full-time. Honestly, I've had the most fun in our business in the last three or four months. It’s been crazy busy for just three guys—we’ve got a lot to do. It's a stressful but nice place to be sometimes.

I've enjoyed being back in the machine, and I think that’s led to a lot of reflecting and mindset shifts. My mindset is always evolving, and it may change again next year. If you listen back to my podcast from last year, I probably had a different perspective then. I think you develop that through experience, realizing where you're at and where you want to go.

With just three of us, I’m in the field full-time. If we have only one septic to do, my partner Brad and our main guy Matt will handle it, and I’ll take time in the office to get things done. But generally, we have multiple septics to complete, so I end up working on my own the most. I don’t mind working by myself. If I need help, I call in a subcontractor for a day. I have subs I can rely on and just pay them a day rate when necessary.

I handle all our sales, estimating, designs, permits, and locates. I meet with clients and also install full-time. My partner takes care of repairs, inspections, and any equipment maintenance. We’re out of the pumping business now, so he’s no longer pumping—just installing full-time and handling service calls when needed.

Austin Gray: You guys are cranking. You're handling like three people's jobs right now—plus back-office work.

Brock Peele: Yeah.

Austin Gray: You’re still doing billing, right?

Brock Peele: Yeah, I do all our invoicing. I have a bookkeeper, obviously, and I’ve recently gotten my wife more involved since we went down to three people. She’s jumped in to help, which, if you had asked me three years ago, I would have told you I’d never do that.

I never really wanted my wife involved in my business—not because I don’t want her there, but because I didn’t want to put that burden on her. She’s gotten involved recently in a very strategic way—taking on small but impactful tasks. It’s not a huge position, but it’s been helpful.

Since we went down to three guys, I've been trying to run as lean as possible with low overhead, figuring out what works. Every problem is a revenue problem. Money fixes a lot of things in business—if you have money in the bank.

Austin Gray: So true.

Brock Peele: I don’t care what anyone says—you need money to do anything. Right now, we’re at the stage in our business where the goal is to make as much money as possible and stack as much cash as possible so we can make moves later.

I learned a lesson from earlier this season—we made some big moves, hired people, but didn’t have enough cash reserves. We burned through it quickly, and our overhead got really high. We were profitable, but not to the degree we wanted. When I ran the numbers weekly, bi-weekly, and monthly, I realized we weren’t in a sustainable position.

This setup would have been fine if we could work 12 months a year, but realistically, we weren’t making enough to survive the slow winter months. That’s been a big lesson for us—working as hard and lean as possible while being strategic about growth.

Austin Gray: How many months can you work? Remind us of that—I know we talked about it in the other episodes.

Brock Peele: Most people around here will say you’ve got to make 12 months' worth of money in six months. I would say that’s fairly accurate. You can probably stretch it out to maybe seven or eight months, depending, but we have half-low season, which is a nightmare. We can’t really do much until May, and then last year, we were able to work right until January, no problem—we were doing septics in January.

But this year, as soon as December hit, we got hit with four or five feet of snow. It took us two and a half weeks to get one of our skid steers because of a big snowfall, and that just made a colossal mess for us everywhere. The system I’ve been putting in the last couple of days has been an absolute nightmare with all the snow coming down. So, I’d say our season here pretty much wrapped up at the end of November for what we could realistically do. We’ve been working from May to November, so that’s six—really, six or seven—good months.

Austin Gray: So, for the listeners here, he did $2.3 million in revenue in six months of working with three guys.

Brock Peele: Yeah, we’ve had some pretty big weeks. There were five of us at one point—I had a driver, and if you listened to my last episode, I had my sister in the office, who was also a dump truck driver. Then, we had another guy who was just an operator.

From April to around August, I think we were at about $900,000. Then, from September 1st until now, with three guys, we’ve done over a million dollars. That’s September, October, and November—three and a half months. We’ve been averaging around $400,000 to $500,000 a month for the last two or three months.

Austin Gray: It’s so funny because you see all these people on YouTube saying, “Make your first $10,000 a month,” and you’re out here putting up half a million a month. Man, I’m so impressed. I think you’re setting the standard for all of us in this industry—it’s incredible to watch.

Honestly, I think it would be impressive if you hit $2.3 million in 12 months with three guys. But the fact that you’re doing that in six? I don’t think I’m the only one who finds that mind-blowing. It’s impressive. So, thanks for putting in the work and for setting the bar high. I think it’s awesome, and I hope more people hear about this—I hope it motivates more people to just get out there and get after it.

Brock Peele: Yeah, and just to butt in here—a big number is not always a good number. Anybody listening needs to know that, too. Big numbers aren’t always good numbers.

I know guys who are doing a third of what we’re doing, and they’re very profitable. They run very lean, with one- or two-man crews, have all their equipment paid for, and are making great money. They might be doing $600,000 to $800,000 a year, but they’re still taking home $200,000. Their profit margins are strong—netting 25% to 30% at the end of the year.

At our stage in the business, netting 30% on $2.3 million just isn’t possible with the kind of overhead we have. That’s another thing to remember—just because we hit this number doesn’t mean I want to hit $5 million or $10 million next year. That’s not my goal.

I’m proud of hitting that kind of number with three guys because now we know what’s possible. If we can do $2 million a year with three guys, then it’s about refining our practices, paying down equipment, reducing overhead, and fine-tuning everything to increase margins while keeping revenue the same.

When you get into this business—especially in the beginning—it's all about moving dirt, working, and making money. You go so fast and so hard that sometimes you hardly know what’s going on. But at the end of the year, when you reflect, you have to ask: “What will we do differently next year?”

If your only goal every year is to double your revenue, that’s not really a strategy. My goal is to find a good balance, get a lot of work done, and improve our practices to have a higher profit margin at the end of the year.

Austin Gray: Absolutely. I appreciate you clarifying that. I should have asked this earlier—I was making an assumption. If you’re decreasing the number of people and overhead, I assume profit went up?

Brock Peele: It did, yeah.

Austin Gray: So, profit did go up from Year 1 to Year 2?

Brock Peele: Yeah, for sure.

Austin Gray: Because at the end of the day, we can all talk revenue, but sometimes revenue is just a vanity metric if it’s not efficient.

Brock Peele: Yeah.

Austin Gray: So, profit did go up?

Brock Peele: Yeah.

Austin Gray: What are you thinking about changing for next year?

Brock Peele: I think a four-man crew is optimal for what we’re doing. We’re pretty lean right now, but adding one more guy would be nice. To be honest, my focus is on making money and strategically placing us in a strong position.

I’d like to pay off our 13-ton excavator—that’s close to a $5,000/month payment. If I can clear that, it frees up a wage. Once that’s paid off, I might bring on another team member, which would make my life easier and reduce how many roles I have to fill myself.

Right now, I just want to maximize profits, put us in a strong position, and avoid growing too fast.

Austin Gray: So, for next year, do you think $2 million is the sweet spot for revenue? Is the goal to replicate that and use profits to pay down equipment before thinking about adding anyone else?

Brock Peele: I think so. Again, I've been working through that over the last couple of months, talking with my partner. We want to build a decent-sized shop at our yard, put an office space in there—which we have now—but we want a new shop with an office, quarters, and things like that. Those are nice things to have, but I wouldn't say they're a necessity. They're obviously not a necessity if we're doing $2.3 million right now without them.

So, that's my analogy. We could really use a tag trailer for the dump truck and a few other things we'd like to have, but we're making money without them. The question is: do we need them right now? What can the market bear, and what can we bear for payments? I just bought a used truck and did an interior swap, putting a bunch of work into it because I don’t want any more payments. It's not that we couldn't afford them, but I don’t feel like we’re in a position to take on more.

I want to put us in a position where we can comfortably take winters off without worrying. I want to ensure that if there are market changes or shifts in the economy, we can survive. I don’t want to have to do two septics a week just to be profitable. If I do one septic a week, I break even, but I have to do two to be profitable. It’d be nice to put ourselves in a position where we can ride things out a little smoother.

So, I think paying off some equipment is what I would really like to do. I know that goes against what a lot of other people would say or think. Even I probably would have thought differently last year. But when your overhead and monthly costs are so high, dealing with that stress makes you reflect and ask yourself: What do I really want? Do I want more shiny equipment to look cool on Instagram, or do I want a good business where I can make good money with less stress?

You're also in a stronger position moving forward. We’d like to get more into civil work—sanitation, storm sewers, things like that—but it’s going to take different equipment. So, putting ourselves in a position where we have some equipment paid off means that when we decide to make an investment, we can afford it. Piling on payments to where you owe $20,000 or $30,000 a month doesn’t seem like a good practice for us, especially when we're so seasonal.

Austin Gray: Yeah, that’s a good way to, one, be really stressed all the time, and two, make it difficult to pivot when necessary. I'd be interested to get your opinion on this, but for me, in the beginning, when I made the decision to do fire mitigation, I identified the three pieces of equipment I needed, and I just went and signed my name on them.

I think there's a certain level of risk you have to take in the beginning, and it sounds like you did the same thing with septic.

Brock Peele: Yeah.

Austin Gray: Right. You basically came to terms with yourself that, I’m okay with taking on this monthly payment because I’m confident I can go find enough jobs to cover it. That’s step one. But to your point, doubling that or jumping into another service requiring different equipment means you're building a completely different business model at that point.

That's something I’ve personally been thinking through a lot, and I like your approach. You've specialized in septics, you have the equipment, and you’re working to get everything profitable and running smoothly. That way, you can withstand a downturn or economic changes.

Brock Peele: Yeah, and I think it’s not just my business but also my personal life that has changed in the last little while. It’s not really a financial change—just a mindset shift.

I just turned 29, and I'll be 30 next year. I feel like I’ve spent the last 10 years of my life risking everything. Every couple of months, I was putting my financial life on the line. I bought a house when I was 19, and for the last decade, every investment I made was an all-or-nothing situation. After a while, that catches up with you.

Now that I have kids, I realize that while there’s always a level of risk in business, I want more security. That doesn’t mean I don’t want to be motivated—I think some overhead is good. But in the past, I would have told you to leverage everything: max out your mortgage, buy rental properties, take on more debt. Now, my goal is to pay off my mortgage in the next couple of years and be completely debt-free on my house. That’s a totally different mindset than I had before.

In business, I want to put my partner, my employees, and myself in a strong position. If your business is financially solid, you're also a more powerful employer. Big companies attract workers because they have the financial stability to survive downturns without immediate layoffs. That’s something important to me.

If we have our septic business doing $2 million a year with two skid steers and two excavators, getting that core equipment paid off gives us flexibility. If we ever want to expand into civil work, we can take on new debt for that while still having our core income as a fallback. That security is invaluable.

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It’s crazy how having kids shifts your mindset. In my 20s, it was just, Let’s go all in—who cares? But now, failure isn't an option. That changes your perspective on how to run a business and personal finances.

Brock Peele: Yeah.

Austin Gray: It’s also about what you want. Some people want to scale their business to 10, 15, or 20 employees, but that’s not for everyone. There are guys who’ve been in this business for 30+ years with just four or five employees. They’ve got their gear paid for, they make good money, their houses are paid off, and they live great lives.

They may not be able to exit their business for $100 million, but the reality is, 99.9% of business owners won’t, either. The goal is to build a good life through your business, not just chase the idea of “bigger is better.”

Brock Peele: Exactly. And things may change, but as of now, I don’t want to manage 20 employees and be stuck in an office all day. When my partner and I scaled back from five guys to three, we looked at each other and thought, Wow, this is great. It was just us and one other guy, working hard, making money, and keeping things simple.

I enjoy being in the field, working on systems, talking with customers, and even hopping in the dump truck when needed. If I can make money doing what I enjoy, I don’t see the need to change that drastically.

That’s winning to me.

Austin Gray: I'm curious—this is something I've been thinking about a lot. We may go a little deeper here, but what is it specifically about operating equipment and being in the field that you enjoy?

Brock Peele: I just like iron, I guess. I like diesel motors. I think it's just the Gearhead in me. When I was a mechanic, we had a saying: Big Parts, Win Hearts. You take off a big part, and everyone thinks it's a huge task, but sometimes it's just four bolts.

I think it's similar to that—what we do looks impressive. You see these big tanks, deep cuts, and massive holes, and it all looks like a big deal. But at the core, it's not rocket science.

There's nothing that makes me happier than hearing the iron running, being on-site, seeing tanks rolling in, concrete trucks arriving, and tri-axles backing up. The sounds of backup alarms, dirt moving—it's all part of it. I love running the site, knowing I'm the guy who designed the system, ordered the tanks, scheduled the trucks, and made it all happen. I sold the job, and I'm the one invoicing and collecting the check.

That's why I don’t want to lose touch with being in the field. I don’t enjoy sitting in an office all day. Sometimes, I have to, but I genuinely enjoy being on-site, watching the job come together, and feeling the energy of the work happening around me.

Austin Gray: That’s awesome. When you’re operating, where does your mind go? Are you completely focused on the task, or does your brain drift to bigger strategic thoughts?

Brock Peele: That’s what I love about being on-site—it allows me to check out from the business side of things. Maybe that’s a bad thing, but I think I need it. When I’m in the machine digging, I'm still getting phone calls constantly, but sometimes I ignore them. I’ll put my phone on silent, throw in my AirPods, listen to a podcast, and just dig for hours.

There have been days when I’ve dug for eight or nine hours straight without stepping out of the cab once. At the end of the day, I hop in my truck and think, Wow, that was the best day I’ve had in months. There’s nothing better than cranking up the Jakes, shifting gears, and running through the pit, knowing that I own that truck and I'm working on my job.

Now, do I want to be a dump truck driver every day? No. If you do it daily, you lose the enjoyment. But when I get in the equipment, I check out for a bit, and that’s something I really appreciate.

Austin Gray: It’s a great escape when you’ve got a million different things happening in business. I don’t know exactly what it is, but I do know it’s good for me mentally.

Brock Peele: Do you remember the first piece of gear you bought?

Austin Gray: Absolutely! I always wanted my own skid steer. Growing up, I ran one for my dad, and it was the dream. I worked concrete summers in West Texas—hot as hell—stamping concrete all day. But when I got to jump in the skid steer instead of manually tamping concrete, it was like being a kid in a candy store.

Brock Peele: That’s what I mean. Anyone in this industry knows that feeling when you buy your first piece of equipment, hook it up to the back of your truck, and drive down the road. You feel like the king of the world.

But over time, you lose sight of that. Some guys get into business because they want a massive operation—15 to 20 guys, tons of gear—but for me, getting back into the equipment reminds me of day one. Sometimes, I look at all our gear spread across job sites and forget just how much we’ve built. If I parked everything in one place and looked at it, I’d be amazed. Five years ago, I couldn’t have imagined this.

But day-to-day, you can feel like you’re not doing enough or that things could be better. Taking a step back to reflect on what you’ve already built is crucial.

Austin Gray: That’s a great word. Here we are, December 21st, heading into 2025. In construction, we’re wired like athletes—it’s a locker room mentality. You can talk crap, dish it out, and push each other to be better. But when you’re always running full speed, it’s easy to lose sight of what you’ve already accomplished.

For anyone listening, take a moment to reflect on 2024. Drive through your yard, look at what you’ve built, and be thankful. Did you do a lot of things right this year? Yes. Did you make mistakes? Also yes. But reflection is just as important as goal setting. Take a half day to appreciate what you have.

Brock, I know you have a family at home. I’m super thankful for mine. When you’re running and gunning, you can lose sight of those things too.

Brock Peele: Absolutely. The past two years have been huge for us. Some might say, Well, it’s easy for you to say because you’re doing over $2 million in revenue. But there are guys doing $10, $20, even $40 million. There are also guys at our level who are way more profitable than us.

But the key is to be happy with where you are. Focus on your own business. Social media is full of smoke and mirrors—brand-new trucks, gear, vacations—but behind the scenes, some of these guys are leveraged to the max, struggling to pay bills.

Stay in your lane and focus on your own success.

Austin Gray: What are some things you’re leaving behind in 2024, and what are you bringing into 2025?

Brock Peele: We’re leaving pumping behind. We sold the pump truck, and 2025 is going to be a more focused year. 2024 was a bit chaotic—our second year trying to figure out what works and what doesn’t. Now, we’re only doing installs and repairs. Cutting out pumping allows us to refine our skills and be more efficient in 2025.

Austin Gray: If you haven’t signed up for the OWNR OPS newsletter, go to OWNR OPS.com/newsletter. We summarize key lessons from podcast guests into short, actionable tips and strategies to grow your local service business.

Brock, have you already processed your reflections on 2024, or do you need more time before finalizing your strategy for 2025?

Brock Peele: I think I’ve processed most of it. But taking some dedicated time to reflect before jumping into 2025 will definitely help fine-tune our strategy. We’re going into this year with clarity and focus, and that’s going to make all the difference.

Brock Peele: No, I've already beat that to death in my mind for the last six weeks or even longer. I already have my decisions made and my projections set for what's going on in 2024 and what's hopefully happening in 2025.

For me, coming near the end of the year brings a little bit of peace. It's like, this is what happened in 2024, this is what we did, this is how much money we made, this is what we are doing, and this is what we're going to do in 2025. I have a very clear, concise mission, and there's not as much uncertainty.

In early 2023, and even going into 2024, there was a lot of uncertainty. You're sitting there jittery the whole time, questioning everything—Do I do this? Do I do that? Is this the right move? Am I doing the right thing? I just hired three people, it's February, and I have to get them going and paid, but we can't move dirt until May.

Now, we have a clearer direction. If things change along the way, I’m not worried. I have a couple of million dollars in quotes for 2025 on civil commercial jobs. Will all of them come together? Probably not. Will any of them? Not sure. But if even one does, it may change the trajectory of 2025. Right now, I know our core business is putting in septic systems, and the work will keep coming. We'll keep focusing on making money and installing septics, without overanalyzing the small stuff.

Austin Gray: If you had to answer in one sentence—what does your business do, and who do you do it for?

Brock Peele: Residential septics. We install septic systems for residential homes, and that's it.

Austin Gray: Let's do a rapid-fire round. Since you’ve already made decisions for 2025, how do you get your customers?

Brock Peele: Referrals and marketing. Over time, we've gained more referrals. Our referral-to-marketing ratio is balancing out compared to when we first started.

Austin Gray: So are you at 50/50 now?

Brock Peele: Yeah, I’d say about 50% of our business is referral-based, and 50% is marketing. It might even be more referral-based now. When we first started, we relied heavily on marketing. Now that we have time in the industry, referrals are growing, and that’s what will hopefully keep propelling us forward to hit our revenue marks.

Austin Gray: If you could only pick one marketing channel, what would it be?

Brock Peele: Website and SEO, if that counts as one.

Austin Gray: Is that the 20% of your marketing that drives 80% of your results?

Brock Peele: Yeah, I’d say so. A good website and strong SEO are key. You can buy followers on Instagram, likes on Facebook, and even Google reviews, but ranking organically on Google takes time. You can't just throw money at it and expect instant results unless you have deep pockets.

Strategically positioning your website for high organic rankings takes time and effort, which is why I believe investing in SEO is essential.

Austin Gray: How much did you spend on SEO in 2024?

Brock Peele: Around $1,500–$1,600 per month, so about $18,000 for the year.

Austin Gray: How much will you spend in 2025?

Brock Peele: About the same. We’re not planning to increase it but may reallocate some marketing spend. We've spent money in areas that haven’t performed well—essentially wasting money. Instead, I could put that money into SEO or maybe another billboard, rather than sponsoring something ineffective.

For 2025, we’re reallocating marketing spend, not necessarily reducing it. Every market is different. For example, lawn care companies thrive on lawn signs and local ads, but that doesn't work for every business. Learning what works for your business takes time.

The key is to track where leads are coming from and reallocate more money to those sources over time.

Austin Gray: Do you get any leads from organic social media, like Instagram or Facebook?

Brock Peele: I believe so. We've had a few people reach out through Instagram, but I see Instagram more as an ongoing digital resume. I don’t think we get much work directly from it, but it builds credibility.

For example, I have designers, engineers, architects, and builders following me. When they see our work consistently, it builds confidence. So when a project comes up, they remember Canadian Sanitation and know we can handle it.

Facebook may work better for some businesses, but I don’t put much into it. Overall, organic social media hasn’t been a huge driver for us.

Austin Gray: What’s your Instagram handle?

Brock Peele: @canadian.sanitation

Austin Gray: Great! If you’re listening and want to check out Brock’s work, follow him there. This has been a great conversation.

By the way, did you ever send me that book we talked about?

Brock Peele: No, I don't think I did.

Austin Gray: I never got it.

Brock Peele: Yeah, Canada Post was on strike for six weeks, so no mail was being delivered. I have a bunch of checks still stuck in the mail! We’ve been sending everything by UPS, but it's expensive to ship to the U.S. I'll send your copy soon. There’s also a link on our Instagram to buy the book.

Austin Gray: For our listeners, can you tell us more about the book? What is it about, and how does it help people?

Brock Peele: I designed it for site visits, based on my experience and the key questions you need to ask when quoting a septic system.

It’s essentially a small notebook with 50 identical pages, acting as a template. You can fill in the customer's name, address, and other crucial details. There are also Ontario Building Code pages in the back, which might not be relevant to everyone, but many of the regulations are transferable across regions.

The back of the book includes calculation templates for estimating materials. If you’re designing a septic system and need to know how much material to order, you can plug in the numbers, follow the formula, and calculate exactly how many tri-axles or tons you need.

Austin Gray: I love it, I love it. That's gold right there.

So yeah, if you are looking to get into the septic world, or if you are currently in it and want some help, Brock has obviously dialed in on his systems. If you haven't listened to the first two episodes, go back and check those out because he shares more about his story and how he made that initial decision. He touched on it again in this episode, but all three episodes I've done with Brock have been nothing short of incredible because of who he is, what he stands for, and his work ethic.

Brock, I appreciate you being on the podcast again. You embody pretty much everything that I've set out to do with my business and what I want to represent with this podcast. At the end of the day, this just takes a lot of hard work—it really does.

Somewhere along the line, I'm seeing this trend in America where people want everything, they want this great life, but they don't want to do the hard work to get there. I don't know where that went wrong, but my whole mission with this podcast is to showcase people like you—people who are out there busting their butts, making it happen, doing three people's jobs, not making excuses, and committing to doing their best every single day. So, thanks for what you do, and thanks for being on again, Brock.

Brock Peele: Yeah, no, I appreciate it. Thanks for having me on. Anytime I get a chance to speak on a platform like this, that's the message I always want to push—there are no cheat codes for any of this. It's just hard work.

It's not as glamorous as some people may make it seem, but at the end of the day, it is what it is—hard work. This is real life. This is what it's really like. Sure, things change as you get bigger, but in the beginning, you just have to get in there and do it. You're not going to have all the answers. If you sit there and overanalyze everything, you'll never take action. A lot of it just needs to be figured out as you go.

Austin Gray: Love it, man. Where else can people find you online? Other than Instagram, are you anywhere else?

Brock Peele: We have Facebook, but it's just tied to my Instagram. I pretty much stick to Instagram—that’s the only thing I'm really on.

Austin Gray: All right, cool. Well, thanks again for being on, Brock.

Listeners, thanks again for tuning in to another episode of the OWNR OPS podcast, where we bring on people like Brock who are out there getting things done and working hard. We love heavy equipment, and so does Brock, but we also want to give you value beyond that—diving into the behind-the-scenes of actually building a business.

If you enjoy this type of content, please make sure to leave us a five-star review. Just like Brock and I are building actual local service-based businesses, podcast reviews are super important. Brock talked about SEO, Google My Business, and getting reviews—podcast reviews work the same way. If you wouldn’t mind leaving us a review, we'd really appreciate it.

We're also doing a weekly newsletter where we take everything from this interview, distill the key lessons, highlight the major topics Brock shared, and send that out to our readers on Saturday mornings. If you haven’t subscribed yet, go to OWNR OPS.com/newsletter—that’s OWNR OPS.com/newsletter.

Thanks again for listening! We’ll see you in the next episode. Don't forget—work hard, do your best, and never settle for less.